Comments on: Temper Tantrums http://www.intheagora.com/archives/2005/04/temper_tantrums/?source=rss current events, culture, faith, science and more Fri, 19 Mar 2010 03:21:36 -0700 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.2 hourly 1 By: philosopher http://www.intheagora.com/archives/2005/04/temper_tantrums/comment-page-1/#comment-7576 philosopher Sat, 09 Apr 2005 06:21:42 +0000 http://intheagora.com/2005/04/temper_tantrums.html#comment-7576 I do agree that pie-ing and other forms of physical assault -- even if not threatening of permanent harm -- should not be tolerated, and I was very glad to see recently that Earlham is suspending its pie-thrower. But I would add that one should not infer from the non-refutation by various protestors that Horowitz is not, in fact, rather easily refuted, in most of he claims. The only sense in which he's not easily refuted, in fact, is in that he frequently fails to actually make an argument; and it's perhaps a category mistake to speak of refuting that which is not an argument. I do agree that pie-ing and other forms of physical assault — even if not threatening of permanent harm — should not be tolerated, and I was very glad to see recently that Earlham is suspending its pie-thrower.
But I would add that one should not infer from the non-refutation by various protestors that Horowitz is not, in fact, rather easily refuted, in most of he claims. The only sense in which he’s not easily refuted, in fact, is in that he frequently fails to actually make an argument; and it’s perhaps a category mistake to speak of refuting that which is not an argument.

]]> By: Robert http://www.intheagora.com/archives/2005/04/temper_tantrums/comment-page-1/#comment-7575 Robert Sat, 09 Apr 2005 02:45:40 +0000 http://intheagora.com/2005/04/temper_tantrums.html#comment-7575 A pie in the face is funny if it's on a sitcom or a circus. A pie in the face to a speaker on a college campus who is presenting his views is a form of physical humiliation that is intended to circumvent intellectual discourse. It is absolutely counter to the very mission of the university, and any instance of this -- regardless of the political position of the target -- has to be thoroughly denounced. (Butler and Earlham have both done so.) In fact, although I am no lawyer, the Indiana Criminal Code seems to classify this incident as battery. Battery is defined in the ICC as "A person who knowingly or intentionally touches another person in a rude, insolent, or angry manner commits battery." Throwing a physical object at somebody constitutes "touching". So Horowitz would be within his rights to press charges, and he has said he would do so. Zach is right -- if Horowitz is so easy to refute, why not refute him instead of attack him? A pie in the face is funny if it’s on a sitcom or a circus. A pie in the face to a speaker on a college campus who is presenting his views is a form of physical humiliation that is intended to circumvent intellectual discourse. It is absolutely counter to the very mission of the university, and any instance of this — regardless of the political position of the target — has to be thoroughly denounced. (Butler and Earlham have both done so.)
In fact, although I am no lawyer, the Indiana Criminal Code seems to classify this incident as battery. Battery is defined in the ICC as “A person who knowingly or intentionally touches another person in a rude, insolent, or angry manner commits battery.” Throwing a physical object at somebody constitutes “touching”. So Horowitz would be within his rights to press charges, and he has said he would do so.
Zach is right — if Horowitz is so easy to refute, why not refute him instead of attack him?

]]> By: Doug http://www.intheagora.com/archives/2005/04/temper_tantrums/comment-page-1/#comment-7574 Doug Fri, 08 Apr 2005 15:46:24 +0000 http://intheagora.com/2005/04/temper_tantrums.html#comment-7574 Come on, don't you watch the Simpsons? <a href="http://www.snpp.com/episodes/4F14" rel="nofollow">Krusty has told us</a> that the pie gag is only funny "if the sap's got dignity." Come on, don’t you watch the Simpsons? Krusty has told us that the pie gag is only funny “if the sap’s got dignity.”

]]> By: Masson's Blog http://www.intheagora.com/archives/2005/04/temper_tantrums/comment-page-1/#comment-7577 Masson's Blog Fri, 08 Apr 2005 15:42:15 +0000 http://intheagora.com/2005/04/temper_tantrums.html#comment-7577 <strong>William Kristol takes one in the face</strong> The Palladium-Item is reporting that William Kristol, neocon editor of the Weekly Standard and member in good standing of the chattering classes was assaulted by a pie while engaging in a debate at Earlham College. I certainly have my reservations... William Kristol takes one in the face

The Palladium-Item is reporting that William Kristol, neocon editor of the Weekly Standard and member in good standing of the chattering classes was assaulted by a pie while engaging in a debate at Earlham College. I certainly have my reservations…

]]> By: A Hermit http://www.intheagora.com/archives/2005/04/temper_tantrums/comment-page-1/#comment-7573 A Hermit Fri, 08 Apr 2005 15:12:45 +0000 http://intheagora.com/2005/04/temper_tantrums.html#comment-7573 See the <a href="http://thinkprogress.org/index.php?p=567" rel="nofollow">Limbaugh dictionary</a> for the difference between "a fraternity prank" and “Fomenting Violence"... Gotta keep the Party Line straight...;-) See the Limbaugh dictionary for the difference between “a fraternity prank” and “Fomenting Violence”…
Gotta keep the Party Line straight…;-)

]]> By: Pete http://www.intheagora.com/archives/2005/04/temper_tantrums/comment-page-1/#comment-7572 Pete Fri, 08 Apr 2005 14:31:53 +0000 http://intheagora.com/2005/04/temper_tantrums.html#comment-7572 Oh, lighten up! There's nothing better than a good pie-in-the-face gag. Plus, this gives us a chance to laugh not just at the pundits, but also at the idiots who think they're making a bold political statement with ranch dressing. And isn't that what life is really about? Oh, lighten up! There’s nothing better than a good pie-in-the-face gag. Plus, this gives us a chance to laugh not just at the pundits, but also at the idiots who think they’re making a bold political statement with ranch dressing. And isn’t that what life is really about?

]]> By: Alan K. Henderson http://www.intheagora.com/archives/2005/04/temper_tantrums/comment-page-1/#comment-7571 Alan K. Henderson Fri, 08 Apr 2005 04:15:41 +0000 http://intheagora.com/2005/04/temper_tantrums.html#comment-7571 Actually it's a reverse "boy who cried wolf" only in that the boy is crying "not wolf" ("food fight") all the time until the real wolf shows up. It parallels the analogy in that a string of relative nonthreats could dampen the stimulus to immediate response in the face of a real threat. Actually it’s a reverse “boy who cried wolf” only in that the boy is crying “not wolf” (”food fight”) all the time until the real wolf shows up. It parallels the analogy in that a string of relative nonthreats could dampen the stimulus to immediate response in the face of a real threat.

]]> By: Alan K. Henderson http://www.intheagora.com/archives/2005/04/temper_tantrums/comment-page-1/#comment-7570 Alan K. Henderson Fri, 08 Apr 2005 04:03:23 +0000 http://intheagora.com/2005/04/temper_tantrums.html#comment-7570 ABB = "Anybody But Bush?" I have to wonder if the food attacks might encourage laxity in campus security. I worry about a reverse of the "boy who cried wolf" - security will get used to the idea of food attacks, and one day the ordnance will be something a lot more menacing than a pie. ABB = “Anybody But Bush?”
I have to wonder if the food attacks might encourage laxity in campus security. I worry about a reverse of the “boy who cried wolf” – security will get used to the idea of food attacks, and one day the ordnance will be something a lot more menacing than a pie.

]]> By: Eric http://www.intheagora.com/archives/2005/04/temper_tantrums/comment-page-1/#comment-7569 Eric Fri, 08 Apr 2005 02:44:47 +0000 http://intheagora.com/2005/04/temper_tantrums.html#comment-7569 ABB? Please explain ABB? Please explain

]]> By: jpe http://www.intheagora.com/archives/2005/04/temper_tantrums/comment-page-1/#comment-7568 jpe Thu, 07 Apr 2005 20:35:02 +0000 http://intheagora.com/2005/04/temper_tantrums.html#comment-7568 I don't have a problem with pie-throwing <i>per se</i>, but the current round of it is stupid, juvenile, and counterproductive. I actually thought that the inital pie-throwers were doing something interesting - they focused on largely behind-the-scenes agents of global capitalism. By doing that, they highlighted that there are actual people involved in the day-to-day operation of globalism, it's not just a machine that functions independently of ethics, etc. etc. Pie-throwing tried to single out the human at the heart of the system, if you will. By contrast, this round is theoretically stupid -pundits, in fact, make their money by being humans (or personalities). In fact, the pie-throwing plays right into the logic of the celebrity pundit system. The pie-throwing just tells america what they hear every sunday morning when they flip past talk shows: these are Important People. I don’t have a problem with pie-throwing per se, but the current round of it is stupid, juvenile, and counterproductive. I actually thought that the inital pie-throwers were doing something interesting – they focused on largely behind-the-scenes agents of global capitalism. By doing that, they highlighted that there are actual people involved in the day-to-day operation of globalism, it’s not just a machine that functions independently of ethics, etc. etc. Pie-throwing tried to single out the human at the heart of the system, if you will.
By contrast, this round is theoretically stupid -pundits, in fact, make their money by being humans (or personalities). In fact, the pie-throwing plays right into the logic of the celebrity pundit system. The pie-throwing just tells america what they hear every sunday morning when they flip past talk shows: these are Important People.

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